Summary
Following Donald Trump’s recent election victory, Google searches for “4B,” a South Korean feminist movement advocating a “no sex, no dating, no marriage, no children” stance, surged in the U.S.
The 4B movement, popular among young women on social media, promotes individual resistance against conservative politics and the erosion of reproductive rights.
The trend reflects a broader ideological divide between young men and women in the U.S., where women under 30 are significantly more liberal than men.
You don’t have to give up marriage, sex, and dating in order to swear off men.
Well said, dragonfucker.
Sigh. This is not and is never the answer.
I’m not sure why this generation is so gung-ho to sell itself out.
Women: “No sex, dating, marriage, or kids until men learn to act right”
John (35yo & single): “Noooooo! It’s not faaaaaair! Who will touch my peepee!?”
Why would they stop? It’s clearly working!
Bold of you to assume that someone was touching my peepee before all those craziness
Hookers are cheaper than a house man. Save yourself the drama.
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What?
You have to be a special kind of stupid to advocate for punishing men because Trump won.
Sane people should not let this interfere with them starting a family. I guess that’s why you can’t understand my point.
Also gonna block you, it’s clear you’re too far gone from these forums.
You have to be a special kind of stupid to miss the point of this movement so extremely. These women don’t want to start families until they feel they have control and safety over their own bodies. Fuck off, facist.
What? Women don’t want to start families until they can be sure they can get an abortion? And you speak for all of them on the matter?
Lol. I think you’re too far gone, buddy.
I think you ate a lot of lead paint as a child. Maybe even as an adult, too.
Yeah, that’s about the response I would expect from someone like you.
Gonna block you now. You need to spend less time on these forums to fix your worldview.
Yellow-bellied coward. Come back here! Fight me on the internet so that i can feel like a big man!!
The movement is great; this thread did connect it to the start of Idiocracy for me though. Smart people having less kids and dumb people breeding like rabbits. I fear this movement has all the potential of limiting the left from reproducing while the right keeps right on going. Gives one pause.
So what, our only option is for people capable of pregnancy to shit out kids to outnumber facists?
Not at all what I suggested. I also believe that this is a good movement. But sometimes there are other side effects.
The reality is many right leaning folks follow religious beliefs that encourage large families and discourage birth control, so be default they do “shit out more kids than the other side” and thus that is why the status Quo for the right was preserved for so many generations, arguably right up until WW2 and the information age when knowledge turned the tide. And the right knows knowledge turned the tide, hence why a large part of Project 2025 is about crippling the education system.
I believe we need to have less kids to reduce population and practice degrowth, frankly. I believe MAGA idiots and any man that voted for Trump do deserve this cock block. I am just also seeing where this may backslide. It’s good to keep looking at all possibilities.
If women aren’t having sex with you, it isn’t a punishment. Nobody owes you sex.
If you want it, earn it. Don’t be an incel.
If you want it, earn it
I don’t know if telling people they need to “earn” sex like it’s transactional is a great thing. Further I don’t think telling people sex is a form of payment is great.
Jim (40yo & married): “this is dumb and obviously just another ploy to turn people against each other”
Lemmy: “anyone who thinks this is stupid is an unfuckable neckbeard rapist!”
Have fun not-fucking the best years of your life away while you get played by the latest payop.
Wonder what the “thing” we’re all enraged about will be next month.
Go away nerd
I’m not quite onboard with your “punishing men” rhetoric later in the thread, but here I agree
Like, how many attempts are now undertaken to pitch men and women against one another or otherwise separate them, and how far can this rabbit hole go?
Men are growing wary of women - and everyone’s cheering as MGTOW raises heads again. Women are getting increasingly defensive - and breed fear and loathing, as crowds cheer again. Both play off each other to show how much the other side sucks.
One is only seen as friendly if they support this division; anyone trying to bridge it is seen as a bad actor.
Stop it. Fuck 4B. Fuck MGTOW. Fuck that conservative dude who thinks they have a right for a woman’s body. Fuck those who put all men into sexual offenders category. Let common sense, love, and responsibility to each other prevail. Go outside and protest gerontocrats trying to take women’s right for their own body. Allow and encourage men to stand alongside and be part of the fight against forces many of them didn’t choose. Never put all people in one basket, and fight your true enemy.
fuck them…
Completely reasonable response to Project 2025.
No sarcasm, I’m quite serious. This is the play.
My only holdup is that I fear this would result in increased sexual assaults. I think the messaging is great, but fear for the collateral.
Okay so we beat the shit out of sexual assaulters in the streets. One problem at a time, baby. The men are at fault here, we don’t blame women for being sexually assaulted for withholding sex. That’s some “she was asking for it with the way she was dressed” shit.
Not in the slightest pretending it’s a “she was asking for it”, more I guess I’m pessimistic and expect the worst out of people. Have to admit things feel less hopeful lately, admire your enthusiasm for beating the shit out of them though <3
That’s some “she was asking for it with the way she was dressed” shit.
Or more like “she was asking for it simply for existing”
Self-selective removal of oneself and those of probable left-leaning male partners from the gene pool* is certainly one strategy left-leaning women could try in the fight for a political environment where their rights are protected and progress further. Probably a terrible strategy, but certainly one that could be chosen.
I respect any individual’s bodily autonomy and am not trying to make a statement in favor of men having a right to access or anything like that. It’s just an illogical movement if the goal is a society that has more individuals likely to support women’s rights - the gamble that thirsty men of the left will somehow save the day or that it would affect men on the right is kind of silly unless we’re assuming that there is a statistically meaningful amount of (secretly) left leaning women out there choosing right wing men as partners. (I wonder if anyone has tried to focus a campaign on seeing if the latter group exists in a sizable amount and can be convinced to be vote left - somebody should look into that and see how it works out. /s)
It’s almost like 4B is something that the right wing would push to further their current advantage in household size in the US…
*I am not seriously implying politics are a matter of genetics (though parents commonly pass down their politics to children in their household via social means), but plenty of people on the right do believe in their own “good genes” versus the “bad genes” of the left and I’m leaning on their perspective for sarcastic effect here.
Yeah, the whole concept of 4B only works if a vast majority of women are on the same page, and given the results from this election, they clearly are not.
It was stolen.
Good for them for asserting their autonomy but basically the end affect is the opening plot of Idiocracy
Until the loneliness of conservative men hits the breaking point.
They have each other. Why does their loneliness require women?
What was the 2024 election if not that?
It was stolen.
White women voting for whoever their white husband/pastor/dad told them to vote for.
Fuck that if they voted for him they’re to blame.
Sure, blame women for the actions of men
I get your point, but I wouldn’t worry about what might happen in 20 years when what is currently happening is bad.
I get your point, but I wouldn’t worry about what might happen in 20 years when what is currently happening is bad.
Ahh, the ol’ false bifurcation ostrich effect as a thought-terminating-looparoo.
I don’t think dismissing eugenics based arguments based on movie plots is a thought terminator lmao.
Downvoting to save words in your reply - nice. Have another upvote.
Your most recent reply actually conveys meaning/makes a specific versus broad point. To that point, I don’t necessarily think they were making a eugenics based argument (though I would agree with you in dismissing an argument based on that) since they didn’t explicitly state the reason for mentioning the movie was because they believe in some idea of politics being genetic versus simply being most effectively passed down via social means from one’s parents while living with them through adolescence. Call me crazy, but I think most of the folks posting here should be given the benefit of not assuming they’re talking about eugenics until they are explicitly promoting it versus something more widely accepted, such as the aforementioned idea that it’s highly likely that parents pass down their politics through social means to their children. I could, of course, be wrong and maybe they were intending to make a eugenics based argument, but they weren’t specific enough to divine that. All of that said, I should edit the phrasing in a sarcastic comment I made elsewhere about removing oneself from the gene pool being a bad strategy since I probably wasn’t clear enough to get across that I was using the very real right-wing perspective where they favor their “good genes” over others’ “genes” for added effect.
Your initial (decidedly vague) comment, as quoted, presents a false choice as if the person you were replying to was worrying about a future problem that is totally disconnected from the current topic of discussion, but they’re not and I don’t think the person you were replying to gave any reason for one to infer that they were ignoring the current issue in favor of some future issue. If they were talking about disconnected topics/problems then what you were saying would make more sense (or if you had been more specific, like in your followup, that would help too). It’s as if the person noticed a ceiling was leaking and exclaimed to someone suggesting to just put a bucket under it “Ignoring a leak is exactly how my neighbor ended up needing to replace their roof, I don’t think the bucket plan is a good plan in the long term!” and you were there to reply “Don’t tell them to worry about the roof, they need to fix the leak!” It’s not wrong, it just doesn’t really say anything or lead to further thought beyond the loop and comes across as a “calm down!”
20 years from now is current when you’re older
Yes, women should rape themselves by having sex with men they are furious with to avoid the ending of a random documentary
I think you misunderstood me. Assuming this is sarcasm, which I think is fair, I was also saying people shouldn’t oppose 4B because of Idiocracy.
The first time you say no to someone you really want to be with, that is when the 4B life starts. Till then, it’s just business as usual (I really hope you don’t sleep with/date people you don’t like!).
The life continues when you see them with someone else, and realise some things can’t be undone. People move on, they’re not static NPCs you can just reload and date later.
It goes ever on, life stops for no-one and it runs it’s course far too soon. To those who choose that path, make sure you know where it leads.
Edit: nice catch apostrofail! I’ll keep no-one though, I feel they need that special dash bond ;)
No judgement, just curious, but is the idea here that conservative men should not be allowed to have sex since they don’t respect women? All for it, agree 100%. But i have a hard time imagining a feminist being with that type of man anyways, since the majority of feminist Ive met have self respect. So then you’re not sleeping with any men to punish them, and yourself, for conservative men? I feel like I’m missing something.
Or is this article just implying 4B is something completly different than what it actually is? You know, cuz clickbait isn’t concerned with being factual…
I think, and here the key word is think as this goes beyond my mandate so to speak, it’s more an act of resistance. A bit like protesting, but with less risk.
I’d say the aim is to rallying over retribution, to push those “good men” into fighting more strongly. It’s not a bad tactic, it’ll be interesting to see how it pans out.
It’s also not really that widespread, searches for it are up because it’s making the rounds is all.
not static NPCs*
for no *one
Understandable.
But sweaering of ALL men is neither healthy nor realistic and the 4B movement is not really helping the issue. Plua the movement is extremely transphobic and essentialist. Its just TERFs doing a thing again…
A more practical solution: Dont date MAGA and leave them if need be. Take the children from them as well. They deserve scorn for voting in a dictator, just because they cant get laid. And they deserve to be reminded on how parhetic they are for all of it every single das until they change.
Downvoted for advocating taking men’s children away.
The problem is that some men will literally tell a woman anything they want to hear until they’re in bed. They will lie their ass off and avoid political discussion until after the proposal, then they’ll suggest maybe she could cook a little more
There’s nothing inherently unhealthy about being asexual.
This is not just being asexual. This incel behaviour.
Wow you don’t understand what incels are at all do you?
It’s called celibacy, and it’s voluntary in this context.
Abstains from sex is celibacy. That’s 1B.
There are 4Bs
The Bs are celibacy, no marriage, no children, no dating. None of that is incel behavior.
Incel = involuntary celibacy
These women are volunteering to be celibate.
4B isn’t about asexuality, it’s about abstinence. Not the same thing.
From a physiological standpoint? Seems virtually the same to me. The other guy said it was unhealthy. Is there anything unhealthy about abstinence?
Asexuality doesn’t have the desire for sex.
This is abstinence for those that would like to have sex but don’t feel safe.
Physiologically it means that abstinence produces stress.
So yes, there are physiological differences, even if they arent measurable on the short term but instead of the long term.
The difference is that one is identity and the other is a choice.
Yes, no one is arguing that. The context was there’s no difference physiologically speaking. That was the premise.
I think the distinction is important to some people.
I have enough respect for those people to know they are smart enough to understand the distinction.
They’re not necessarily the same, there’s two major differences between them physiologicaly:
- Asexual people date others unless they are also aromantic (well aromantic people also can date but it’s less common)
- Some asexual people can and do have sex
Agreed. I also can understand the feelings behind this, but it seems to ignore that quite a number of women voted for Trump.
Bingo. My wife won’t vote for a woman president because she, not me, thinks that they’re too emotional. I know a decent amount of women in the workplace that feel the same way. I voted for Kamala because Trump is a paranoid narcissist that is a thief, liar, and can’t be trusted and she was a darn sight better to keep the boat moving predictably forward.
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Reading comprehension. Jesus you people are stupid.
No wonder why the Democrats continue to underperform.
Might want to re-read that comment.
Women are too emotional to be president? Shit man, maga and their current figurehead are fueled by extremely volatile emotion, no matter how much they crow about facts vs feelings. Rage is an emotion, and it’s what’s driven the movement for years before it even had a name. Citing emotionality as a reason not to elect a woman is just an excuse—a very poor one, at that—and everyone knows it.
Hey, you’re preaching to the choir. Lol.
Your wife is a moron
I hope that made you feel better.
I hope you realize your wife is a moron and a fascist.
Never said she voted for Trump. In fact, we don’t tell each other who we vote for. So yeah, try again. She’s typically strongly independent and really hates the two party system. RCV FTW.
My wife won’t vote for a woman president because she, not me, thinks that they’re too emotional.
This is directly from the Right’s playbook. She’s a moronic fascist.
Talk to her, and teach her the error of her ways. If you continue to be an apologist for a fascist, you might as well give up and join their ranks.
Needs to be said mate
Preaching to the choir doesn’t do any good. Just makes that person feel better about themselves.
They should feel bad
It’s not about feeling better. It’s about calling out bad behavior (i.e. misogyny).
That’s rich. How could one ever think in this election that Kamala was the emotional one. She made one joke about his crowd size and he went completely off the rails.
Got me. I think Trump is incredibly unstable.
Most of the men that voted for Trump aren’t having sex anyway.
Trump has had 3 wives and at least one additional mistress we know of. There are literally women who wear “you can grab my pussy” shirts
How are you this out of touch with reality?
There are plenty of MAGA men with wives and girlfriends. I’m talking about the ones that don’t.
having*
haven’t had*
Thanks buddy, I fixed it just for you.
Coworker is a 54 year old virgin who blames it on the woke agenda.
(He is a total prick.)
They haven’t figured out that Conservatives see this as a huge win? No liberal babies…
anti-natalism rules
Typical media BS.
Found a story about a very small movement somewhere in the world than are blowing it out of proportion and saying this is actually a thing.
This is why Dems lost the election but the media thought they would win.
Fucking click bait sex sells story.
Man here, I fully agree with this.
I have been hoping for something to bring down the birthrate of the states that restrict abortion since the restrictions started.
I had been hoping for mass migration of 50% or so of all women from the relevant states, but I see how that can be difficult.
I truly hope that they are successful in gaining their rights back.
This is a GREAT idea!
So… MGTOW for women?
Okay, bye
